Inspiring Leadership and Public Service with Dr. J.D. Crouch II, CEO of the USO
In the latest episode of the "Executive Health and Life" podcast, Julian had the privilege of sitting down with Dr. J.D. Crouch II, the CEO and President of the United Service Organizations (USO). Dr. Crouch II's extensive career spans business, government, nonprofit, and education, offering a wealth of insights into effective leadership, the importance of public service, and the critical mission of the USO.
This blog post shares some of the highlights of their conversation, covering leadership lessons, the impact of public service, and the innovative programs supporting our military community.
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Bold Decision-Making in Leadership
One of the standout themes from their discussion was Dr. Crouch II's emphasis on bold decision-making. As a leader, the ability to take decisive actions is crucial. Dr. Crouch II shared that not making a decision is, in itself, a decision that can affect how others perceive your leadership. He advised that once you've analyzed a situation and your mind and heart are aligned, it's essential to act. This decisiveness drives progress and builds trust and confidence among your team.
The Call to Public Service
His upbringing didn't initially drive Dr. Crouch II's journey into public service, as his father was in business and his mother was a stay-at-home mom. However, during his undergraduate years, he developed a keen interest in national security issues, leading him to pursue a Ph.D. in international politics instead of law school. His career in public service, including roles as Deputy National Security Advisor and Ambassador to Romania, exemplifies the profound sense of purpose and fulfillment that comes from contributing to a cause larger than oneself.
The Mission of the USO
The United Service Organizations (USO) mission is to enhance the well-being of active-duty military, Guard, and Reserve personnel and their families, ensuring they remain connected to the American people. The USO operates 270 centers worldwide, offering various services and programs. From basic hospitality to comprehensive support like baby showers, reading programs, and digital connections, the USO's efforts provide comfort and a sense of home to service members wherever they are stationed.
Innovative Programs and Support
One of the USO's notable initiatives is the Pathfinder program, which assists service members and their families in transitioning to civilian life. This holistic program offers employment assistance, financial management, and volunteering opportunities, helping veterans find purpose and integrate smoothly into their new roles. The USO also provides cutting-edge support, such as placing USO centers on aircraft carriers, significantly impacting sailors' morale and mental health.
Leadership Insights Across Sectors
Dr. Crouch II's leadership philosophy is grounded in three fundamental principles: purpose, people, and productivity. He highlighted the importance of empathy, seeing things from others' perspectives, and ensuring that each team member understands their role within the larger vision. Drawing inspiration from Patrick Lencioni's "Five Dysfunctions of a Team," he emphasized the need for leaders to balance individual high performance with effective teamwork.
Balancing Personal and Professional Life
Maintaining a balance between personal life and leadership responsibilities is crucial. Dr. Crouch II shared how outside interests, faith, family, and hobbies like cooking help him manage stress and stay cognitively resilient. He noted that some of his best ideas come when he's not actively working, underscoring the importance of taking breaks and finding time for personal interests.
Future of the USO
Dr. Crouch II sees a strong and vibrant future for the USO, driven by digital transformation and innovative programs. The organization aims to leverage data and AI to enhance its services while maintaining the essential human touch that defines its support. As long as there is a U.S. military, the USO will continue connecting service members to the American people and ensuring they feel appreciated and supported.
Advice for Aspiring Leaders
Dr. Crouch II offered valuable advice for young leaders:
Focus on doing your best work rather than seeking credit.
Be bold in decision-making.
Constantly communicate the reasons behind your actions.
Leadership is earned, not assigned, and effective leaders must be empathetic, decisive, and able to build and inspire high-performing teams.
Conclusion
Our conversation with Dr. J.D. Crouch II was enlightening and inspiring. His insights into leadership, public service, and the mission of the USO provide a roadmap for aspiring leaders and a testament to the profound impact of dedicated service. To learn more about the USO and how you can support its mission, visit uso.org.
Connect with Dr. J.D. Crouch II
USO Website — https://uso.org/
Transcript
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(0:00) Be bold, right? (0:02) Because here's what happens. (0:04) If you're in that position as a younger leader, and people see you not making a decision, is in fact making a decision.
(0:14) And the people around you will begin to question your leadership. (0:18) And you may have very good reasons for wanting to delay it, and it's hard to do, and it's, you know, that sort of thing. (0:25) But I would say, no, once you've done the analysis, once you're, you're both your mind and your heart are telling you, yes, I've got to do this, take action.
Julian Hayes II
(0:38) Welcome everyone to another episode of Executive Health and Life. (0:42) I'm your host, Julian Hayes II. (0:43) And as I always have to and love to say, I'm with a fascinating guest.
(0:47) And today's guest is definitely fitting that bill. (0:50) He's someone who's been involved in business, government, nonprofit, and education. (0:54) I'm speaking with Dr. J.D. Crouch, who is the CEO and President of the United Service Organizations. (0:59) The USO is the leading nonprofit that's dedicated to strengthening the well-being of the people serving in America's military and their families since 1941. (1:08) Dr. Crouch also, as mentioned, has a long and distinguished career in the government, including serving as the Deputy National Security Advisor and Ambassador to Romania in the George W. (1:18) Bush administration.
(1:19) He also spent nearly a decade being a professor and was the CEO of a company that had a successful exit. (1:25) So he's had leadership experience across a domain of areas. (1:29) So without further ado, Dr. Crouch, how are you doing today?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(1:32) It's fantastic, Julian. (1:34) Thank you so much for having me.
Julian Hayes II
(1:35) Thank you so much for joining me on here. (1:37) I'm really looking forward to this. (1:39) And, you know, going across your bio and just researching you a little bit, you know, there's a big glaring theme and it's public service.
(1:46) And so I'm curious, was there a moment in time that just made you really become one who wanted to do public service, or was it the way that you grew up?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(1:58) Yeah. (1:58) You know, my father was in business and my mom was kind of a stay-at-home mom back in the day. (2:08) And so not really.
(2:09) I mean, there wasn't something that sort of drove me to that. (2:12) And I, like many people in my generation, I was, you know, I went to an undergraduate and I was going to do that. (2:17) And then I thought I'd go to law school, you know, and then I got intrigued with national security issues and some of the challenges that our country was facing back then, you know, in the Cold War.
(2:30) And this is sort of the 1980 to 1982 timeframe. (2:35) And it was a difficult time. (2:37) I mean, if you go back and look at the history there.
(2:40) And so it really intrigued me. (2:43) I decided to blow off law school and do something different. (2:47) And I went on and got actually got a PhD in international politics and came to Washington and I absolutely got the public service bug.
(2:56) There's no question about it. (2:57) You know, look, I love business and I think businesses, if we didn't have a vibrant business community, we wouldn't have the country we have now. (3:05) But if you get an opportunity to serve in public service, it really is about something bigger than you.
(3:10) It's about bigger than it. (3:12) And that's the thing that's very exciting about it. (3:14) It's motivating.
(3:16) And it's really all about kind of life purpose, if you will.
Julian Hayes II
(3:20) Would you say that's the biggest draw? (3:22) Because I don't know too many people in my upbringing in my area who has dedicated themselves to just public service. (3:29) So for someone like me, would you say that's the biggest draw to kind of convince us?
(3:34) And I know we'll get into this more with the USO. (3:36) But when it comes to public service, what's the biggest kind of way that you recruit people?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(3:41) Yeah, I mean, I think it is. (3:43) I mean, I think, you know, people are looking, we know one of the analogies for this is we actually at the USO run a transition program, where we help people getting out of the military, make that transition to civilian life. (3:57) And one of the things we hear from them is, you know, there are interesting jobs out there and stuff like that.
(4:04) But I don't have that feeling of doing something that's larger than myself, of being on a team, right, that is, you know, really functioning, you know, there's literally, I know, it's, you know, the old saying, there is no I and T, right. (4:21) And, and I think, and honestly, sometimes they have trouble making that transition, and they have trouble putting themselves out there, like you have to in the private sector to say, Alright, what is what am I going to do for the organization, right? (4:34) Because they've grown up in that.
(4:36) So, so I do think yes, and so recruiting for a nonprofit, you know, we've got a lot of people who are there who are very, I would just call it mission driven, right? (4:46) That's what they're about. (4:48) Now, you still need other skill sets, and you need to develop other things.
(4:51) So yeah, I think that's the, yes, that's, that's the thing that distinguishes it, perhaps, because it often is not pay. (5:00) You know, I mean, people who, you know, join the nonprofit sector or the public sector, you know, you're, you're not, your potential, right, is not necessarily as high as in the private sector, but you reap other benefits.
Julian Hayes II
(5:16) Speaking about service and larger than life, I look at education as that way as well. (5:23) It's transformative in my life. (5:26) And what got you into deciding to be a professor during that time?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(5:30) Right. (5:32) So I, you know, I, I probably didn't have to finish a PhD to go on and just serve in the government and do things like that. (5:44) But I wanted to, because I wanted to have the option to teach.
(5:48) And I had tremendous mentors who were at the college level, and even some of my high school teachers were just amazing. (5:58) And they really, you know, you know what they convinced me of? (6:02) They convinced me that I could, I could do things.
(6:04) They convinced me, they convinced me that there was this whole world of ideas out there that was really important to the future of humanity. (6:12) And, you know, and I, I, I didn't, I didn't come to that, you know, my, my, my dad never went to college. (6:20) My mom didn't go to college, you know, in fact, I was the first person, other than an uncle, I think that you even went to college.
(6:27) So it was, it was kind of a, an eye opening thing that, hey, you can have, I don't want to say intellectual life, but a life of ideas, right, that can then help me help motivate you to do the things you want to do. (6:41) So when I got an opportunity to teach, I took it. (6:45) And, you know, spent about 10 years, as you said, as a professor, I was mostly teaching graduate students, but also undergraduates.
(6:52) And I really, really loved my time. (6:55) I was at Missouri State University, which was down in Springfield. (6:58) I really loved my time there.
Julian Hayes II
(7:01) It does. (7:02) I'm the same with you. (7:03) Mother, father didn't go to school as well.
(7:05) And to me, what it does is you get, you get exposure to, like you said, new ideas to kind of expanding your paradigm. (7:12) And speaking of that, I'm very curious, when you became the National Security Advisor and Ambassador to Romania, did you have a connection to Romania already? (7:22) I guess, I'm curious, how does that assign?
(7:23) Because I know there's different ambassadors to different countries.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(7:26) Sure. (7:27) So there, you know, just generally there, there, there's about two thirds of the ambassadors that the United States sends out to countries are Foreign Service officers. (7:35) So they are people who came into the Foreign Service, worked their way up, you know, at various levels.
(7:40) And at some point, they're, they can be appointed to be an ambassador. (7:44) About a third of them are what are called political appointees, and they are appointed by the President. (7:50) And, you know, many of those folks are, you know, they're political supporters of the President, some of them engaged in, they've got distinguished business careers that they were able to then transform.
(8:03) I was a bit of a hybrid, I was not a Foreign Service officer, but I was also not, you know, a big donor, or something like that. (8:10) But I had been Assistant Secretary of Defense in the Bush administration. (8:15) And my portfolio included all of Europe, Russia, NATO, all those sorts of issues, right, all those kind of countries, as well as other, you know, functional things.
(8:27) And so when I left that position, I think the White House President, whatever, said, all right, we're looking for a role here for somebody in Romania. (8:37) And they offered, they offered me that role. (8:40) So I was a known quantity in the administration, if that makes sense.
(8:45) And they were looking for somebody who was political, who was tied to the President, that sometimes is important for the receiving country, and somebody who understood national security issues. (8:57) Because if you recall, back then, we, Romanians were in Afghanistan with us. (9:03) They were in Iraq, Romanian soldiers were, you know, fighting alongside of Americans.
(9:08) And so that was part of that, part of that milieu. (9:11) So that's how I ended up with the opportunity. (9:16) I mean, I was very lucky to get it and take it very seriously.
(9:20) When you're an ambassador, you're the face of your country in that country. (9:26) And it's very humbling, and, you know, scary, because, you know, you don't want to trip up, because everybody looks to you. (9:34) And the US is a big country, you know, it's an important country.
(9:37) So people are constantly looking at you.
Julian Hayes II
(9:41) That was going to be one of my next points to make, is that when you are an ambassador, you are that viewpoint. (9:47) And to some people, I remember, even if you just go traveling to a different country, sometimes, you're the first person from the US that they're going to meet. (9:55) And so a lot of times, the only thing they know about the US is what they see on TV, or maybe something on the internet, but then to meet someone that's actually from the US, you're going to leave an impression on that.
(10:03) So I think that, so even when I travel, it's almost an honor. (10:06) And I realized that I have to kind of hold myself to a certain standard to give a good impression, because it's not just me, it's also representing the country as well.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(10:14) Absolutely, you know, you're spot on. (10:17) And there's nothing worse than being overseas and seeing an American kind of not being not behaving properly, right. (10:27) And so, and back here, we see that same person doing it, we don't take as much meaning from it.
(10:33) But you're right, the people over there, like, well, gosh, if this American is acting this way, then maybe all Americans act this way. (10:39) And we know that's not true. (10:41) But they don't.
(10:42) And so it's, it is absolutely important.
Julian Hayes II
(10:47) So, you know, and touching on the other pillar now of the business private sector, what got you interested to to go down that route?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(10:55) Yeah, so I sort of had two different things I did in that prior to coming back into government, while I was out of government and teaching, I co founded a software delivery company, we basically built an app store called palmgear.com. (11:15) And so you may not remember the old device pre iPhone, the old palm pilot device, this was a kind of a organizer communicator kind of device similar, but kind of, if you will, a progenitor of the iPhone. (11:31) And my partner and I built an app store that was really one of the first successful app stores.
(11:37) I mean, it, it, it basically brought in software from all over the world that could then be put on this device, and enabled the device to do, you know, a myriad of things. (11:48) And we ended up actually, you know, doing the back ends for palm computing and for others. (11:55) So that that was one thing.
(11:56) So that I would say that was more like a startup thing, you know, it was it was really kind of, and then after I got out of government, the last time I went from the Deputy National Security Advisor, I was, I was looking to get back into business, I wanted to, I've gotten my taste of that from the, from the entrepreneurial side of it. (12:15) And I was looking to work with a company that, and I did some consulting for a while, kind of looking for a company, and ended up at a really cool place called kinetic North America, which has subsequently kind of, I mean, it's still around, but parts of it have been sold off. (12:32) And it was, it's got a queue on both ends.
(12:36) It was famously sort of, you know, the spin out of the UK government, Q branch, you know, the from James Bond, you know, yeah, and so this was their, I don't know if you've heard of something called DARPA. (12:51) DARPA is our government organization, Defense Advanced Research and Projects Agency. (12:57) Well, this was the UK's DARPA.
(13:00) And so they spun it out, created this company called kinetic, and they built a US subsidiary, and I ran the US subsidiary eventually, and, and really loved it. (13:12) So we did all kinds of, you know, kind of cool things made robots and, and stuff like that. (13:17) A lot of devices that help to protect soldiers lives and things like that.
(13:22) So yeah, so that was so I was very motivated to get back into business. (13:26) Why? (13:27) I love hard problems.
(13:29) And I love I love the team aspect of being in a business, you know, I'm being a consultant is great. (13:35) And I love, you know, I like doing that, too. (13:38) But I really, I really drawn to being able to be on a team or leading a team.
(13:46) Kind of kind of brings out, I think, more energy for me.
Julian Hayes II
(13:50) Speaking of different teams, and leading different teams, you know, leading one in business, leading one in being part of one of the government, and then also the nonprofit now, and then also the educational sector, what are kind of some similarities that that's helped you be able to kind of cross cross over into all these different areas with your leadership?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(14:12) Yeah. (14:12) Well, you know, when I think about the things that I want, and I think a lot of humans want, right. (14:23) In other words, I, it's not, it's not, I don't mean to say it's about me, but it, but I sort of think of three things.
(14:30) And I think one is I call purpose, you know, where, you know, oftentimes, or can can find yourself, you know, in a position where there's really, you don't feel drawn to it, you don't feel a purpose. (14:43) Now, you know, obviously, you can't, there are a lot of good companies out there, maybe, maybe it's not the super passion you've got, I think you can have purpose without necessarily, you know, working for, you know, solve world hunger, right? (14:56) So, so there's a lot of good purposes out there.
(14:59) But I just think, for me, anything I went into, I really had to feel that sense of purpose. (15:04) And, and as a leader, you need to infuse that sense of purpose, right? (15:09) It's called vision, right?
(15:10) I mean, it's, that's what we, that's the word we use for it. (15:14) The second thing for me, and is people. (15:18) And that is keeping them uppermost in mind and, and recognizing, first of all, I would say, if you're working around a bunch of people that, you know, are working for someone that you really can't live with, run away.
(15:36) Okay, you know, now, be careful, because, you know, give them a chance and try to try to walk in their shoes and try to think about it the way they do. (15:46) But if they're really kind of a toxic person that I use one way, but being surrounded by people and being one of those people that can work together toward that common purpose, is a to me a really important part of that. (15:59) And as a leader, then you have to build that team.
(16:04) And sometimes that means you have to make some really hard decisions. (16:08) You know, you've got to, you've got, you may have to ask somebody to change. (16:14) And if you can't get them to change, you may have to change them, if you know what I'm saying.
(16:19) But I would also say, you need to be willing to change. (16:24) Because the purpose and the organization you're in is not about you. (16:28) It's about the team and about getting, you know, getting the mission done.
(16:32) And, and there may be, you know, just because you're the CEO doesn't mean that everybody has to align strictly the way you do things, you know, you have to be open, I think, and willing to change yourself to make the team more effective. (16:48) And then the last thing I would just say, and these all happen to have peas in front of them, you know, purpose, people, productivity, you've got to, I think people have to feel like they're making progress, you know, that there's good that you get up, you get up in the morning, and I not only is this something that should be done, but it's something that can be done. (17:12) Right?
(17:12) There are a lot of things that should be done. (17:15) But, but, but, but, you know, so I think you've got to instill that sense. (17:18) And that's a broad sense of productivity.
(17:21) I don't, I don't mean it in, you know, beans and bullets kind of sense, but but in that broader sense of everyone thinks we're, we've got the goal, and we're moving toward the goal. (17:32) Right? (17:33) And, and it's important for a leader to keep reminding people of that to keep demonstrating that in various ways, to celebrating progress you're making or, or, or the like.
(17:45) So I would say those are some things that, you know, as I cut across all of those, you know, if you're helping a young person through their education, if you're in a nonprofit setting, in a business setting, and certainly in government, it's one of the things that can be very frustrating in government, because government is not known for speed.
Julian Hayes II
(18:06) No, they're not.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(18:07) Yeah. (18:07) And so it can be very frustrating. (18:09) But you got to temper that and understand that you're, you know, government can do big things.
(18:14) It just can't do them fast.
Julian Hayes II
(18:17) So I guess that's, and I always think about that in the businesses, that if you're a small startup, you're so agile, and you can move so quick, to whereas when you start gaining even in market share, and you start gaining in size of employees and offices, and those kind of things, takes a little longer to move. (18:33) But when you do move, it can be much more forceful than that, then that startup of maybe four to five people.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(18:40) Yes, absolutely. (18:41) Absolutely. (18:42) And you know, the startup, the startup is just that, right?
(18:46) It's a startup. (18:47) And so it's, it isn't where you want to end. (18:51) I do think some people are very adept at startups.
(18:55) And what you'll find is that, you know, people who come in as a CEO of a startup, once that company gets to a certain mass, they're not the right person to lead it to the next level. (19:05) It doesn't mean they're a bad person. (19:07) It doesn't mean they're not good.
(19:08) They probably need to go find another startup. (19:10) You know what I mean? (19:11) They need that that's their skill set, right?
(19:15) And so difference and boards have to contend with this too. (19:19) And it can be very difficult, particularly if the startup CEO is also the founder.
Julian Hayes II
(19:26) And so speaking of leading, let's talk about what you're currently doing now with the USO. (19:32) And what was the, how'd you get involved? (19:35) How'd you get involved with the USO?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(19:37) So I was finishing up, I, the parent company that I mentioned to you, Kinetic in the UK, I decided to sell the lion's share of Kinetic North America. (19:50) I, along with my colleagues there in, ran the roadshow that basically sold the company to private equity. (19:59) They combined, they've combined it with a number of different companies over the years.
(20:02) And, and it's so it's, it still exists, but it's not under the Kinetic brand. (20:08) And toward the end of that process, I got a phone call from a search firm. (20:13) And they said, you know, there's this opportunity, would you know anybody who would be interested?
(20:18) And I almost immediately said, you know, Julian, no, I'm not a great organization, but I'm not interested, but let me see who I can see might be interested. (20:27) Right. (20:27) But I didn't say that.
(20:29) And I went home, I talked to my wife, who's been, is a very important part of my decision making process. (20:36) And she said, well, why not? (20:38) Why not take the next step?
(20:39) You know, you, this could be something really good. (20:42) And, you know, I was involved in a lot of decisions in the White House. (20:48) For example, during that very difficult time with Iraq in 2006 or so, President came to the National Security Advisor and me and said, I want you to, I want you to run a process that says, hey, what do we do here?
(21:02) And, you know, I don't want to, you know, I don't want to waste any more blood and treasure on this if we can't win. (21:08) But if we can win, I want, I want to know what to do. (21:11) And that process led to recommendations to do what became known as the surge in Iraq, things like that.
(21:18) So I say that because I didn't make those decisions, the President made them, but I was involved in that process. (21:25) And I felt like the USO was a great way to give back to those service members that I have been around for my entire adult life. (21:35) You know, every aspect of my national security career, I was not in the military, but I was around them.
(21:42) And the more I learned about the USO and what its mission was, and that the more excited I got about it. (21:48) And so I threw my hat in the ring. (21:50) And that's, that's how it, that's how it happened.
(21:52) I was planning on going back into another leadership role in the business sector, that was, that would have been the normal course, right. (22:00) And I ended up, I've ended up staying here 10 years, which is longer than I thought I would, because there was a lot to do. (22:09) But also because I love it so much.
Julian Hayes II
(22:13) What, what is the, like, the mission of the USO for those are not familiar? (22:18) And also what are, I guess, like, you mentioned, there's a lot to do? (22:22) What were like some of those things that you wanted to get to get done?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(22:26) Right. (22:27) So the mission is, is all about, in a sense, it is all about serving those who serve in uniform. (22:35) And that includes, by the way, their family.
(22:38) So our, our population of people that we serve are the active duty, military, the Guard, National Guard and Reserve components and their families. (22:49) That's a population of about 5 million people. (22:53) And what we do is, we do it in a number of ways.
(22:58) But the macro effect that we're having is making sure that those people who are serving on our behalf, and often in harm's way, in very difficult jobs all around the world, have a constant sense of gratitude and connection to the American people. (23:18) Because, you know, when you're, when you're sitting right now, we've got 10,000 troops deployed in Poland up near the Ukrainian border. (23:27) And when you're there on Christmas Eve, and they're, they're not accompanied deployments, you know, their families, their spouses, their girlfriends, their mothers, their fathers, their boyfriends, they're all back home.
(23:39) And you're there on Christmas Eve, you know, somebody has to show them that America is thinking about you, America cares about you. (23:49) America is proud of you for what you are doing for your sacrifice. (23:53) So that is, you know, ultimately, that's the MAC, that's the, that's the mission of the organization.
(23:59) Now, how do we do that? (24:01) We do it in a myriad of ways. (24:02) We really cover them from the beginning, they get into the military, all the way through to when they exit.
(24:10) We run 270 centers or so around the world. (24:16) And there really are in our facilities, you know, you can come in. (24:21) Soldiers will describe it to me this way.
(24:24) When I come into the USO for an hour, I feel like the uniform has melted off me. (24:29) I feel like I'm an American again, I feel like I'm just a regular American, you know, and I'm, I'm there, I can sit down, somebody's going to give me a hot dog or a hot cup of coffee and maybe talk to me. (24:40) Sometimes I'll sit down and I'll be playing video games with my buddies 6000 miles away, or I'm on Wi Fi with my family back home or, or, or there'll be an event that will be sponsored there, you know.
(24:52) So those centers really are kind of our platform for being able to provide a whole host of programs. (24:58) And they run the gamut of stuff for single soldiers, all the way up to, you know, we throw baby showers for service members and their families who are overseas, we, we do, we have a great program, it's a reading program where you can sit down in Poland or Iraq, read a bedtime story to your child. (25:21) And that video and the book will arrive, you know, almost instantaneously, because we send the video directly and Amazon drop shifts the book to automatically.
(25:33) And, and, and now you get to watch, you know, through that child, you get to watch mommy or daddy, reading that good night story to you, you know, even though they're 8000 miles away. (25:42) So it's those kinds of things. (25:45) So we do it in a broad set of ways.
(25:48) But that's the really, the basic mission is to that sense of gratitude that we impart.
Julian Hayes II
(25:55) I was reading a little bit and I think I saw something I think it's called a pathfinder program. (26:00) And is it helping the veterans transitioning into this? (26:03) Is it the different workplaces?
(26:06) And is it any type of workplace? (26:08) Or is it like more of a business entrepreneurial venture?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(26:13) Yeah, so, so, so the pathfinder is the kind of, you know, name, if you will, brand for our transition program. (26:20) And we have we've, we have two, two kinds of transitions there. (26:24) It's open, by the way, not just to the service member, but also to spouses.
(26:27) And we actually help spouses in that program now, who are transitioning through their spouses military career. (26:38) So imagine that, you know, you were married to a military officer, okay? (26:44) You'd be moving every two to three years.
Julian Hayes II
(26:47) Okay, it's hard to set routes that way.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(26:49) It is hard to set routes that way. (26:51) And it's hard to, you know, how do you keep employment? (26:53) And how do you you know, and so we help them with those transitions.
(27:00) But, but the lion's share of what we're doing there is when they decide to transition out of the military. (27:06) And then we help them with employment. (27:10) So we'll connect them, you know, we do have sort of a deep interview with them and say, you know, what do you want to do?
(27:17) And we help them turn that into a really strong resume. (27:22) You know, if you're a heavy machine gunner, a marine platoon, it may not be obvious what you can do in the real world. (27:32) But actually, employers love those people.
(27:37) Why? (27:37) They've been responsible for very expensive equipment they've taken, they've demonstrated the ability to operate under stress. (27:45) They know what working and building a team is.
(27:49) Think about some of the people who don't have that kind of experience who are coming and competing for those jobs. (27:53) These guys have a guys and gals have got a real advantage, right? (27:58) We help them see that we help them realize that then we help them with other things to, you know, financial management and other other aspects, a really important element of that.
(28:09) And it goes back to your earlier question is, we also help them think about how they can plug into volunteering. (28:20) Because this goes back to this question of a purpose bigger than your life. (28:25) And there, there are great ways to volunteer through your company.
(28:29) Right? (28:30) A lot of companies have got what are called vet nets now, where their networks inside the company of people who are veterans of the military who can go do things to help others in their community or other veterans and the like. (28:44) So that's that transition program tries to be as holistic as possible.
(28:48) And it really will connect them in with particular even particular employers, but certainly or or guide them Julian to that. (28:58) What's the training I need? (29:00) You know, if I want to be a podcaster, what's the training I need to do that, right?
Julian Hayes II
(29:06) Yeah. (29:08) What's the future of the US? (29:10) So what do you see on the horizon?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(29:13) Well, you know, I guess there's a kind of a high level, you know, as long as there's a US military, there's going to need to be a USO. (29:21) And one of the challenges right now with the with the employment environment and other other things we've got is it's recruiting for the military is tough. (29:32) We have an all volunteer force.
(29:34) And we can't take our military for granted. (29:38) We live in a world. (29:40) It's a dangerous world.
(29:41) I wish it wasn't. (29:43) I wish we could not have that. (29:45) But I think the reality is it is and a lot of what we do, you know, the fact that you know, you and I could travel around the world, do the things that we do, our, our military kind of underpins that.
(29:57) So it's important for the country. (29:59) It's important for all of us. (30:00) It's important for business.
(30:01) And so we need to have folks doing that. (30:03) So I think it's really important that the USO stay strong, vibrant and keep our force connected to the people that they're that they're serving. (30:12) In terms of what's, you know, next inside, right?
(30:17) A number of things. (30:18) We're, we're embarking right now on a really exciting digital transformation. (30:24) And we're looking at, we don't think we'll ever be, we're not going to be just providing our services digitally, right?
(30:32) The human touch is increased is really important for what we do. (30:37) But the ability to use data, make data driven decisions, understand more about our customers. (30:47) And in fact, incorporate that into into, you know, AI type applications, where are we can do more is, is something all nonprofits are going to have to do.
(30:58) And so we've embarked on that journey. (30:59) And we'll work, we're working that one really hard. (31:02) And then the other thing we're trying to do is find new ways to connect with our service members.
(31:08) I mentioned, we were in Poland, we just built a bunch of new centers there. (31:12) But one of the coolest things we've done in the last year and a half, we've put USO centers on four aircraft carriers. (31:20) Wow.
(31:21) And by the end of the year, I think we'll have eight or nine. (31:25) And this is a game changer, you know, for them, you may have read that there's been some, you know, suicide issues and things like this in the Navy, and the Navy is really dedicated, they came to us, they're really dedicated to trying to fix this problem. (31:41) And they are doing everything they can.
(31:43) And so they've enlisted us, as well as others to try to help, you know, and so a place, like I said, a place where a sailor can come in, and the uniform melts off for an hour. (31:56) And they can reconnect with family, friends, whatever, or maybe just playing a video game, and you know, before they they're forgetting about what they're doing. (32:08) It's a huge stress reliever, right?
(32:10) Stress, as you know, is the biggest challenge right now, not just for CEOs, but for instance, and others, you know, and so dealing with we're a stress reducer. (32:22) So that's a cool program. (32:24) And it's, it's emblematic of how we do business, we are a very agile organization, I'm so proud of my team.
(32:33) You know, you remember when we deployed to Poland, the US military right after that was January of 22. (32:41) Putin had just invaded Ukraine, headlines, you know, 82nd Airborne, 101st Airborne, flying into into into Poland. (32:53) Guess who met them there?
(32:56) The USO. (32:58) We were there already. (32:59) We were ready for them.
(33:01) We were cooking them a pancake breakfast. (33:03) That's an agile organization, right? (33:05) That's, that's an organization that's looking out.
(33:08) So that's what we need to be. (33:10) And and so it's been really great to I've got a great team. (33:14) And they're, they're the ones who do, you know, do all this.
(33:17) And it's really been exciting.
Julian Hayes II
(33:20) Speaking of team building for younger leaders out there, and myself definitely included in this, what do you think are some, maybe two to three big things that we should keep in mind when we, as we're building teams?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(33:37) One is, you know, it's an overused word, Julian, but but empathy, and by empathy, I do not mean necessarily sympathy. (33:49) I mean, there are times to have sympathy, but I'm just saying that and to me, the best way to describe empathy is can you put yourself in the other person's shoes. (33:58) And so when you're building a team, it's not enough to just say, here's the vision.
(34:07) Here's the purpose. (34:08) Isn't this exciting? (34:10) Isn't this what we should all be looking to do?
(34:13) But that's important. (34:14) And that has to be there too. (34:16) But you also have to ask, does Julian see himself in this?
(34:21) Does Julian see a purposeful role for himself in what I'm in what I am proposing we do? (34:28) You're right, or that we've come together. (34:31) And that's not those, sometimes it's automatic or easy, but sometimes it's not.
(34:37) So you got to keep your, you got to keep your eye on that, because you'll never, you'll never get things done. (34:44) And if you don't have a well functioning team. (34:49) Right?
(34:49) I think that's one, one aspect of it. (34:52) Another one, I just would shamelessly crib from Lencioni. (34:57) Have you read Lencioni's Five Dysfunctions of a Team?
Julian Hayes II
(35:03) Love all his books. (35:05) I even reached out to thank one of them. (35:07) And so they sent me a signed copy back on one of them, because it was transformative on a lot of my development.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(35:12) No, no. (35:12) And what I love about that, that first book, I think it's the first book, is, you know, in the parable, the person who is making the team dysfunctional is a, is a high performer. (35:32) And yes, you need to have high performance, you want to have high performing individuals, but you also have to perform as a team in that way.
(35:40) And sometimes a person who is high performing individual can't function within the team. (35:48) And it's the leader's, I think, role to try to figure that out and coach them in the right direction, right? (35:57) And get them to see that, and to get them to see that their high potential is great, but it's not, it's not enough.
(36:05) You know, and so whenever I, you know, talk, I use, I use Lencioni to, you know, kind of score people on you know, what are the ideal characteristics of a team player? (36:16) You know, yes, you got to be smart, and you got to have, you know, I mean, intellectually smart, and you've got to have expertise and all those things. (36:25) But the three that he uses, I love hungry, humble, and smart.
(36:31) And by smart, he means EQ, not IQ. (36:35) You know, how do I work with that? (36:37) Can I work smartly with other people?
(36:39) So that's, that's one to me that is also really important in thinking about running, building, running high performing teams.
Julian Hayes II
(36:53) And as we get ready to start wrapping this down, I'm curious about yourself, how do you, with such a, this is a, anytime you're in leadership, it's a cognitively demanding task, it can be emotionally draining, sometimes it can be a stressor, as we talked about, how do you keep yourself going mentally, physically, emotionally, with so many things going on?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(37:16) Well, I've been in some pretty, I've been in other roles that were extremely stressful. (37:22) And I saw what I'm going to say now is kind of where I am now, I'm not sure I can say that I necessarily was able to do this through the whole career. (37:29) I would start out by saying this, you know, it's the old truism, right?
(37:33) You know, your career is not a sprint, it's a marathon. (37:36) And, but, but what's wrong with that idea is that sometimes it is a sprint. (37:43) In other words, there are sprints within the marathon, you know, but you can't sustain those, you've got to be able to take a break, and you've got to be able to, and I think I think leaders have to be cognizant of that with the, with the people that they're leading, that they have to be listening for that.
(38:04) They have to, you know, give them some, give them some space to do that. (38:10) Personally, I, you know, I have outside interests, I think that's really important. (38:15) I look at my life, you know, kind of as I've got the spiritual side of my life is very important.
(38:23) And it is with my wife as well. (38:26) My family is very important. (38:27) And my work, you know, those are the three components.
(38:30) And then I would add on to that sort of my outside interests, you know, and those I have found those outside interests, some of the best ideas I've been able to come up with, have been things that have happened when I wasn't doing my job. (38:45) I don't know if other people have experienced this, but you know, it's not just laying on a beach, or it's not, you know, closing the room and ideating, you know, I don't do that. (38:54) But I do, I do outdoor activities, I love to read, you know, stuff that's not necessarily related to what I'm doing, you know, I like to cook, my wife and I both cook, you know, so we find time for those things.
(39:11) And those clear your mind, I think they help clear your mind and make you a better CEO. (39:19) Now, there are times, like I said, back to my sprint point, there are times when it's, you know, all hands on deck. (39:25) And right, and then you don't have as much time for that sort of thing.
(39:28) But I think over that marathon, you need to build in some of those outside interests. (39:34) And one of the things I've got, I've got a spouse is willing to let me do that. (39:39) She's, she's fantastic.
(39:41) And she's got outside interests, right. (39:44) But so our faith and our, and our commitment to ourselves, and our family are the top two priorities for us. (39:54) And I think that really helps to provide that kind of balance.
Julian Hayes II
(39:58) And it seems to me also with mentors, and something that I've noticed with some of my mentors is that you get better at determining what is actually a crisis, what is actually something that requires all hands on deck, and then compared to what is something that in the grand scheme of things, isn't the type of big issue that you're making it. (40:17) And I think that's for me, something I'm still working on, you know, I'm an adolescent, as I always say, a business and so many different ventures. (40:25) But so a lot of times things I think is a big deal, or I'm going to start worrying big time over in the grand scheme of things, it's not that big of a deal.
(40:32) And that's what it seems like leaders who have some some wisdom and years behind them. (40:36) They're very good at deciphering what's an actual true all hands on deck moment.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(40:43) Well said, I mean, that's exactly, it's exactly right. (40:46) I have a little phrase I say, you know, don't just do something, stand there. (40:51) Right?
(40:52) It's not. (40:53) No, don't just stand there, do something. (40:55) Sometimes you have to sit back and you have to say, Wait a minute, wait a minute, this is just stand there and watch this and see and don't don't get everybody else riled up and and then see how it plays out.
(41:10) And a it may not be as big a deal as people thought, or B, the solution may present itself in the fullness of time. (41:21) You know, now there are obviously exceptions to that where it's a true crisis or something like that. (41:26) But But yeah, I know, very few things are true crises.
Julian Hayes II
(41:31) Absolutely. (41:32) And what the last question here is that someone comes up to you at a cafe, and they asked you, what are one to three things that I can start doing today to improve as a leader? (41:43) What would you tell them?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(41:47) Um, one thing I would tell them, and this, this was something that that it was, I think it was like a little plaque or something that sat on Ronald Reagan's desk when he was president. (41:59) And it said, there's no limit to what you can get done if you don't care who gets the credit. (42:07) And a lot of times when you're a young person, there's tension there, because you, you're thinking, I've got to show that I'm the one who did this.
(42:20) And what I would say to them is, if you do this, you will be noticed. (42:26) Don't focus on getting the credit for it, focus on doing it and doing it the best job you can. (42:34) And so it will, and that will reflect not only not will your leaders see that, but your peers will see it as well.
(42:43) And they will, they will want to follow you. (42:47) You know, leaders aren't assigned, right? (42:51) Leadership is not like, you're a leader now, you know, no, leadership is earned.
(42:57) Right. (42:58) And so that would be, you know, that would be one thing. (43:02) I would say another one is, you know, maybe the summary for that is be bold.
(43:12) But you know, you, you, if you've got decisions to make, you know, don't hard decisions to make, and often the hardest are frankly, with personnel. (43:22) But but don't, don't wait. (43:25) I mean, I'm not saying don't be don't, don't shoot from the hip.
(43:28) But once you've made a decision that something has to happen, act on it. (43:37) You know, be bold, right? (43:40) Because here's what happens if you if you're in that position as a younger leader, and people see you not make see not making a decision is in fact making a decision.
(43:52) And the people around you will begin to question your leadership. (43:56) And you may have very good reasons for wanting to delay it. (43:59) And it's hard to do.
(44:01) And it's, you know, that sort of thing. (44:03) But I would say no, once you've done the analysis, once you're, you're both your mind and your heart are telling you, yes, I've got to do this. (44:12) Take action.
(44:13) Right. (44:14) And, and people will be responsive to that. (44:17) And I will say people will be responsive to that, even if they disagree with you.
(44:22) You know, you're never going to get everybody to agree with you. (44:24) But, but if they see, you know what, I wouldn't have done that. (44:28) But I understand what Julian's doing.
(44:29) I understand why he's doing it. (44:31) And by the way, communicating the why is very important in that. (44:35) But I would say that, that those would be two things just to think about as you're, as you're kind of trying to develop that sense of what distinguishes a leader from somebody who's just maybe on a team.
Julian Hayes II
(44:47) I love those points. (44:48) And that's a great way to put a nice bow to this conversation. (44:51) I really enjoyed this conversation.
(44:53) Where can, where can people go to find out more about what the USO is doing?
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(44:58) Go to our website, uso.org. (45:04) And you can find out, you know, we've got opportunities to support the organization. (45:08) And we've got a great opportunities for volunteering.
(45:11) You know, as I said, we're 270 locations, Julian, I only have 800 employees, including everybody.
Julian Hayes II
(45:18) Oh, wow.
Dr. J.D. Crouch II
(45:19) So how do we do that? (45:20) We do that because we have an army of 20,000 volunteers. (45:24) So there's a great, it's a great opportunity to volunteer and our service members love our volunteers and our volunteers love our service members.
(45:35) So it's a, it's a really a win-win.
Julian Hayes II
(45:39) And I will have that in the show notes, in case some of you are driving, running, or doing something else in the moment. (45:45) So I'll have that in the show notes. (45:46) Thank you again, Dr. Crouch for joining me and for listeners out there, stay awesome, be limitless. (45:51) And as always, go be the CEO of your health and your life. (45:53) Peace.
